Virtual-Doug

Bargaining

Dương Lam Anh is a teaching colleague and a contributor to this blog, both as a writer and a commenter.  In writing this post, he brings up one of my favorite topics – the necessity for relationships in Vietnamese culture.  You may also want to read Relationships,  posted on December 12 last year.  Be sure to read the comments too.

No, I have never been interested in bargaining and frankly speaking, I have no idea of it. Very bad at remembering numbers; I can’t do calculations in my mind. (I always need a pen and paper to do that.)  I almost never go to the market here and I am really afraid of having to bargain.  All I can do is confirm the right price by asking “Is that the real price?” with a blushing face, though I definitely know what the answer will be.  It’s just to assure myself I’m not buying something too expensive.  I end up buying things at a higher price than my sister doing with the same things.  Anyway I enjoy buying things from a quiet supermarket or a store with price tags on the goods.  There people move along shelves, looking for what they want, read the tags, put their purchases in a cart, line up at the counter, pay up and leave.  All in order and silence.

Until one day…

I went to a workshop on American Studies given by Mart Stewart.  He said he liked the idea the Vietnamese banknotes are decorated with pictures of the beautiful places in the country; he observed the way Vietnamese people buy and sell things at the market and said it was life.  He found life in it and I found his thought fascinating!

And I began to observe my mother buying things.  My mother is old and her weak legs prevent her from going to the market to buy food every day as before, though I know she always misses it.  She has a keen memory and very good at buying things; her ability to do calculations in her mind despite her old age is admirable.  Though she doesn’t go out a lot now (except when needed and when we are free to carry her on our motorbikes,) she can buy almost everything at home, fresh fruits, veggies, flowers, even breakfast in the morning, spices, snacks etc in the afternoon.  Rain or shine, street vendors never fail to drop at my house in due time bringing their things.  I note they sell things to the neighbors too but very quickly; a few exchanges and leave, but they stay longer at my house.  Here, there is a routine that the first person who buys may bring good/bad luck to the seller and that’s why sellers always expect someone in particular to be their first buyer and these venders always like my mother to be the first.  They drop by, sell things and talk to my mother.  By bargaining and talking, my mother can socialize and set up good relationships with many vendors.  They talk about everything and she obtains lots of information through their chatting. My mother wonders about the higher price of something; and the seller explains the reason why; my mother decides not to buy something and explain why she doesn’t like it and the whole story is told.  And then their chat drifts to traffic, economy, politics, life, etc. almost everything, I assure you, my mother is kept informed of the updated news that way.  It is not simply selling and buying things, it’s like sharing experience.  (I don’t bargain, I have to read papers for news ) Mart is right.  Life is all there.  I began to develop a habit of watching my mother buying things. Sometimes, she doesn’t bargain just to reduce the price; she makes sure things are *value for money*.  Every now and then, she’s willing to buy something at a higher price if it is really good quality and worthy.  My mother is rather picky about foods. She always wants to be the first person who chooses things and ready to pay more for that.  But the most interesting thing is she buys in a way that both she and the seller feel pleased and happy … I came to the realization that for my mother, this every-day affair is entertainment and we feel sad if some day the street venders don’t drop by for some reason.

No, I still hate bargaining because I don’t know how.  I still prefer buying things from a shop with the price announced loud and clear where people put on indifferent faces,  buy and sell things in silence (but somewhat like machines ), no bargaining, no joking, even no loud talking.  But I begin to become more tolerant toward bargaining. I realize why the markets like Dong Ba, An Cuu, etc. can’t be replaced with closed air-conditioned supermarkets because people still need them.  Simply because they are life…

Long Weekend

I have a long holiday weekend stretching in front of me.

This is a quiz. What reader can tell me the two holidays celebrated back to back each year on these dates in Việt Nam?

But, I intend to be “productive.”  No, I don’t mean I intend to do lesson planning – I intend to go riding with Mr. Cu again, and take another short jaunt on Sunday with students.

Hard work, eh?   But somebody has to do it.

Việt Nam in Transition: Transportation

Getting around a Vietnamese town conjures up touristy visions of xích lô drivers and rickety bicycles.  But in the emerging Việt Nam, the xích lô is going the way of the oxcart and the bicycle is rapidly being replaced by the môto.  The môto is the family mover and used for runs to the market.   In the two large cities of Sài Gòn and Hà Nội, the môto is in the early stages of being replaced by the automobile.

As always, be sure to click on the picture to see the full-sized version.

Automobiles are not unusual sights in Huê, though the streets are not clogged with them – yet.  The vast majority of them are Japanese brands one might see anywhere in the world.  Many auto makers, such as Toyota, Mercedes, and Ford have large assembly plants in the country.  If you visit Việt Nam using a tour agency, most likely you will travel in comfort in an air-conditioned van.  Even if you decide to “rough it” and travel by bus from city to city, you will ride in a modern Korean-made vehicle.  The day of the colorful, smoke belching, overloaded local bus is just about gone.

Commercial transportation is changing rapidly too.  In the north part of Huê, the railroad runs parallel to Highway 1, the main north-south artery for the entire country.  As is seen here, most of it is a four lane divided roadway that can handle heavy trucks, such as this Korean lorry used to haul steel construction materials for an Australian-Vietnamese joint stock company.

Việt Nam’s fledgling aviation sector is growing.  There are now two airlines serving most of the mid-sized cities.  Huê’s airport is south of the city at the old American base at Phu Bai.  The new control tower just went into service and handles both local traffic and planes flying through the area on high altitude routes.

So the next time you see the exotic photo of the Vietnamese pedicab known as the cyclo (xích lô), just remember that the real Việt Nam may be a bit different than expected.

One Building’s Construction

Okay – its been awhile since I’ve written about the new house, but the folks have been working.  My bum ankle prevented me from walking across the street, but now that it has healed, its time to check out the construction.

Looking nice on the outside.  All the window frames are in, and the base coat of paint has been applied.  The faux brick tiles look nice, as does the wall and fence.

But most of the recent work has been on the inside.  All the interior walls have now been finished – and rather nicely too.  Of course, the stairs need a little work . . .  For reasons I don’t understand, most interior walls of nicer homes in the Huê area are painted the same shade of buttery yellow.

The majority of the work being done is installing flooring.  One almost always walks on either cement or tile in a Vietnamese home.  This makes for very “live” rooms.  I have never seen carpeting in any home, except for the occasional throw rug.  By the way, I have noticed that the same crew has been working on the house since the beginning – the workers seem to be “jack of all trades” kind of people. Of course, some specialty areas, such as plumbing or electrical work, require skilled workers, but most of the rest is done by the same people.  I see the same guys doing tile work who did the wall finishing who did the foundation pouring who did the window installation.

Have you noticed how long this house has taken to build?  We started following this on September 17th   – and it has a long way to go before anybody lives in it.  There are no quick construction methods here – labor is cheap.

It’s a Wonderful Life

My brother (otherwise known as The Hoppy Mailman ) will not let a Christmas season go by without watching “It’s a Wonderful Life”.  This classic old film is about a man who does not know how much his life has impacted others.  The viewer learns that what we do affects many people.

But I doubt my brother would have ever thought that something he did would wind up in Việt Nam. 

My brother is one of The Last Great Romantics.  On his wedding day, he sang Clint Black’s “Something That We Do” to his bride.  Now, I’m not much of a country music fan, but I was impressed.  No – not impressed with my brother’s singing ability.   I was impressed with the lyrics of the song.

Awhile back, I used it in one of my speaking classes.  I made up a handout for the students with the lyrics – but with some of the words blank.   I play the song on my iPod with speakers, and they listen for the words that are blank.  It helps build listening skills and vocabulary.  The rhythm of singing helps people speak better too.  After singing it a few times, the students sing along enthusiastically (the Vietnamese love karaoke) .  We take a little time to discuss the meaning of the song and their new words, then sing it again. 

Then, the Mystery Guest Blogger used it with her students.  Same enthusiastic response. 

Vietnamese blogger , and regular visitor to our apartment, Le Bao Tuan liked it too – and posted the lyrics on his blog Sticky Rice.

Our fellow teacher heard it – and once she got past the nasal twang of country singing, she liked it.  Then she decided to use it.  She used it in the mock wedding.  Four Vietnamese girls sang “Something That We Do” as part of the music.

There you have it, Bro.  It’s a small world, and even though I would hate to have to paint it, this shows  you just never know where you influence will end.

A Discussion: Social Gatherings

People who visit Việt Nam for three weeks know enough to go home and write a book about the country.  But, the longer I stay here, the more I realize what I don’t know.  I am fortunate in having other people help me learn.

Mark is a librarian in Toronto.  During his six months in Hà Nội, he wrote an superb blog titled “Six Months in Hanoi.”  Mark is a excellent observer of human behavior.  After his return to Toronto he posted a marvelous story titled “Both Sides Now.”  Please – before you go on, read Mark’s post. 

The concepts fascinated me.  Because I navigate the Vietnamese culture on the periphery, I was not sure if what he wrote was correct, yet my own experience seemed to indicate its true.  The Vietnamese are very open and welcoming, and that is genuine.  Yet, I’ve had the distant feeling that I wasn’t allowed into deeper relationships. 

I am fortunate to have a Vietnamese teaching colleague named Lam Anh.  He did his graduate work in Boston, and his research area is American Culture.  We co-teach a course.  I bounced Mark’s ideas off of Lam Anh, and here is his analysis.  (If you haven’t read Mark’s posting, this will make little sense.)

It's fascinating observation and it is so true. His story brings me back to the ideas of two types of party that in Vietnam we call "sitting party" and "standing party" (buffet). "Standing party" is more Westernized while the latter is more traditionally Vietnamese. (Though today buffets are becoming more popular, especially to young people.) I do like that type of party for its informality and casualness but I'm sure "standing party" is something rather weird to the majority of the older in Vietnam. "Standing party" makes it possible for you to go around saying hi to various people, introducing yourself and socializing. In case you say something wrong (say, a slip of the tongue), no one feels hurt; no one cares since they know it is just fun; no commitment, no formality and also, people will forget everything very soon. In such a large group of people many of whom you have just met, what else can be talked besides introduction, work, so and so.

The Vietnamese "sitting party" is quite different. People who know each other tend to sit together in groups. Because they are not strangers, they can be very open and ready to share intimate things ("like in a family" as Mark wrote). They may not notice you because they think you have your own group. That way of partying prevents people from going around to socialize; and they feel no need to. What I don't like about it is its formality. If one is going to give a party like that, one should arrange the seats so that those who know each other can sit together.

The American may like the other way because they like making new friends, which the Vietnamese do, too but they seem more comfortable in their group as they don't believe in making friends so quickly. In a Vietnamese man's mind, friendship is the thing that lasts. The word "friend" in Vietnamese is a close person who can share with you some level of intimacy; a man he doesn't know well or has just met is just "a person he knows", certainly not a "friend" in full meaning. In American culture, "friend" may mean anyone they are talking to. And they do distinguish friendship and friendliness.

Being a Vietnamese who used to live in America and love both cultures, I sometimes find myself torn between the two. During my time in America, I certainly had many American friends and they were very nice and kind to me at school but then, in retrospective, I remember finding myself hanging around with some Asian friends at weekend. In our chatting, we sometimes talked about what we called "the invisible wall" between Americans. An unseen wall made of schedules, plans, appointments, time, etc. They made friends very quickly then went their separate ways as they moved to another class; "easy come, easy go." Is it so that Robert Frost wrote "Good fences make good neighbors" I wonder. I imagine a Vietnamese writer would rather write "Good neighbors are ones without fences".

Mark mentioned the family-like intimacy between Vietnamese friends, "No need to make plans days in advance because it was taken for granted that the group would hang out. One phone call and half an hour later the group might be meeting for coffee or bia hoi." Being a young and rather busy Vietnamese educated both in Vietnam and the US, I certainly feel more comfortable with a schedule in which everything is planned in advance but equally I don't feel frustrated if my friends called me suddenly asking me to join them for a coffee. I may say no if I'm busy, but definitely no complaint. Why angry with those who just want to bring me fun?

So my friends Americans, if you happen to be in a Vietnamese party/meeting and find people clustering in groups without much noticing the others, then take it easy. It doesn't mean that they are not happy with your presence or are not polite to you.

Just because that's the way it is!

Thank you to both my “friends.”  I use the American connotation as I have never met Mark face-to-face, and I have only known Lam Anh for a year or so.

I invite others to share their observations.  In my case I was struck by Lam Anh’s “Invisible Wall” theory – and I think he has a strong point.

He is Risen - He is Risen Indeed

Happy Easter!

Different Perspectives Redux

Note to the Gentle Readers of this Blog.  I am totally aware that some of the recent postings on this blog may be a bit boring to some – there are no homey pictures of Huê, nor any tidbits about food, friends, or travel.  But beginning with the posting on Desk Art , I’ve had input from folks involved in teaching here in Viet Nam.  This has been a stimulating and worthwhile exchange for me and for others interested in cross cultural work.  For those of you who have not been a part of the conversation, be sure to read the comments below each posting.

In the post Different Perspectives , my colleague Lam Anh made an excellent comment.  As always, he challenges my preconceptions and ideas with his well written thoughts.  I decided his comment was too good to be consigned to the comment section where few people would see it, so have made it a stand alone posting.  In his comment, Lam Anh hits many topics, not just classroom issues.

I look forward to more feedback from all of you.

Yes, you mentioned the blind men feeling the elephant, then why don’t we put our minds together so that we can see the whole elephant as it is? (Though I know that is really a big one.)

I am with you that students here are less active; they speak less and seem to participate less in class. I agree that many students have been in a non-interactive environment, especially at lower levels; and I don’t deny the fact that many classes here are basically lectures as opposed to an interactive environment. But a closer observation finds the same thing in other meetings also, not only in the class; not only in a foreign language but in the mother tongue as well. (I’m curious to know what HanoiMark saw at staff meetings? And what difference?) Obviously, there is something more than that; something culture-based that people can’t see at first sight and on the surface and a good teacher should investigate the issue to find out what is the proper way to do.

Certainly it isn’t because students are discouraged to ask questions by the teacher, at least in language classes. It is true that in the past, the English textbooks at high schools here were, for the most part, grammar-based and translation-based and some teachers did *lecture*. But today, English textbooks have put on a new face. Teaching materials partly determine teaching methods. I can’t imagine teaching those textbooks the other way… I wonder about the language teachers that Triet mentioned in Ho Chi Minh City. They can *lecture* a content-based/ dialogue-oriented textbook? And doesn’t the change in chair type at Hue College of Education that Doug mentioned mean something? Doesn’t the fact that the English Department used to divide the class into halves to make them smaller say something? (Not this year, for some reasons.) Certainly students are not discouraged to speak in English classes by the teacher.
Tu hit a good point of losing face. Yes, the Westerners focus on GUILT, the Easterners emphasize FACE. The Americans say they *agree by disagreement*, the Vietnamese think *silence means consent*, the Westerners *speak out their thoughts*, the Vietnamese *curl their tongues seven times before saying * (Americans may argue they do say *think twice* but the Vietnamese say *seven*.) If only you could see the *push-and-pull* in a Vietnamese student wanting to say something in class. That can’t be seen but just be felt; that can’t be examined from outside but from inside. Yes, we *learn by mistakes* but the notion of face plays a big part here in Vietnam.

The Vietnamese concept of modesty should be acknowledged, too. Have you ever noticed the fact that when you, as a teacher, asked a question in class, no one answered, but if you took nerve to call a certain name, very likely, he/she gave you a perfect answer? Didn’t you ask yourself why? Have you ever seen that the silent ones in class might talk more when you put them in small groups? Did you feel surprised and ask yourself how come? Have you ever questioned yourself why an individual in the class knew the answer very well but kept mute and urged his/her friend to say it out loud for him/her?

Of course, I’m not saying this to defend passive learning. I just take this opportunity to pose questions for debate and supply some food for thought. A single factor means nothing but they altogether count.

And…Once in my graduate class in Boston, a male student from (?), who is among the more silent in the class wrote in his journal that American teachers tend to judge students’ participation through what he/she says in class but they don’t know that people don’t say in class doesn’t necessarily mean people are not working. They are working in their minds!

A-ha!

Yes, that folk was and his response was eye-opening, at least to me…

Hopalong (Update)

There are two types of môto riders in Việt Nam:  those who have fallen off their môto, and those who will.

I just had my fall – and its rather embarrassing.  Before I explain, read The Mystery Guest Blogger’s  “Traffic Test – Việt Nam Style.”  Pay particular attention to Questions One and Five. 

After class one day last week, I was on the way home.  As I turned right into a side street, another môto was coming towards me.  Yes – in America, we would say he was on the wrong side of the street – but read MGB’s story again.  The other driver was doing the normal thing of cutting the corner to the left in order to go up the left side of his new street.  I too did the normal thing, and gave him the space to go around me. 

But – aha!  I forgot another dynamic - - people passing on the right.  A young man on his bicycle tried to squeeze between me and the curb – and we touched.

If you are a skier, you know how easy it is to fall while standing in the lift line.  In this case, I was barely moving, so had little gyroscopic balance.  Over I went, trying to keep my head from hitting the curb.  I emerged with a scraped knee, and a bit of road rash on my right elbow.  That’s it – I was okay.  Many apologies, many exchanges of “You okay?”, and I was on my way.  The MGB slathered on some antibiotic ointment, attached a couple of band-aids, then told me to get back work.

My ankle was a little sore – I remembered the foot peg came down on it – but I taught my classes and generally got along fine.  The MGB and I had fun watching the bruise marks get uglier – but then it really started to hurt.  The pain worsened – and the MGB thought she spotted the first signs of an infection, so she started me on a regimen of Cipro.  Finally I gave in, and we went to the Huê hospital for an x-ray.

Would you believe a tiny fracture of one of the ankle bones?  I had a cast put on, then we were shooed out the door as it was approaching lunch and nap time..

Folks – I’m okay.  I really am.  I have to stay off the foot for three weeks, which is a real hassle for me to teach.  But, I’m not in pain, and my foot is not going to fall off.  My biggest problem is trying to figure out how to use crutches built for much shorter people.

If the same thing had happened when I was thirty, I’d had no problem.  But the bones are a bit more brittle now.

This is an old man’s injury – and this too shall pass.

Thanx to my friend Mr. Cu for the photographs, and steering us through the hospital.

---

This is an addendum, posted after Tom Murray asked his question in the Comments section below.  It was such as good question, I wanted everyone to see my answer.

Tom asked a great question - -

First of, may I suggest to any foreigner visiting Việt Nam to take out medical insurance.  Folks - you just flat don't know what will happen.  The most prominent company is International SOS.  When the MGB had her bad headaches in January, it was SOS that evacuated her to Bangkok.  Very very professional!

In this case, our first telephone call was to the SOS English speaking physician in Hà  Noi.  He advised us to go the Huê Hospital for an x-ray.  He wanted the Vietnamese physician to call him with the results.  We were fortunate to have a very competent Dr. Phuc look after me.  He and the SOS doc concurred in both the diagnosis and treatment.

Cost?  About $22.00 US.  BUT - and this is a big caveat, I had my friend Mr. Cu go with me.  He made sure we got the Vietnamese price.  The normal price for services for foreigners is double or triple the price to a Vietnamese patient.  In January, the hospital charged $220 US for the MGB’s CT scan – it is $90 for Vietnamese patients.

In my opinion, most westerners have trouble coping with the appearance of poor sanitary conditions in Viet Nam.  I say "appearance" because I happen to believe westerners have an overblown need for things to be clean to the point of obsession.  Nonetheless, our culture teaches us that, so the lower standards of cleanliness are a problem for westerners to cope with.  That doesn’t change the fact that I received excellent care and service.

Different Perspectives

In the recent post about Desk Art , my teaching colleague Lam Anh made a wonderful assessment of my observation about teaching English in Whazzit Like to Teach English in Việt Nam?

His observations and mine are quite different.  Lam Anh feels that most younger Vietnamese teachers use high levels of interaction whilst teaching, and my perception is that most students are not accustomed to having teachers interact with them – especially if they use questions as a teaching tool.

Possibly this is somewhat like the three blind men who encounter an elephant.  Each cannot see the whole elephant, so each describes the beast in terms of what he can feel.  One will tell you an elephant and is hard and smooth – because he felt the tusk.  Another will tell you elephants are rough and tall because he felt a leg.  The third will tell you elephants are rough-skinned, very flexible, and sinewy – and he felt the trunk.  All were correct, though their observations were incomplete.

I wonder what part of the elephant I didn’t see.  During a research trip a few years ago to small cities such as Phan Rang and Quy Nhon, I saw no questions asked at all – just pure lecture.  I also know that with my brand new first year students, they were extremely recalcitrant to talk to me for the first month or so.  When questioned, they just giggled nervously and refused to answer. (Note:  one of those students reads this blog, and she is the exception.)

Let me add this to my cordial debate with Lam Anh:  is it possible in my past observations, that I saw some of the older teachers he mentions, and that they also were not teaching at a more progressive school such as Đại Học Sư Phạm (Huê College of Pedagogy)?  Is it possible that Lam Anh is among the academic elite of Việt Nam who was taught by progressive teachers and mirrors their practices in his own teaching?

Another variable is that my first year students may have never had a foreign native speaking teacher before.  (I assume that is very likely – native speaking teachers are either at universities or teach at private schools in Hồ Chí Minh City or Hà Nội

Still another variable (which Lam Anh tacitly acknowledges) is that he is teaching foreign language skills, which demand interaction.  I wonder how many of the students’ other classes in history, chemistry, political science, or other topics are as interactive as language classes.

It’s a big elephant – and there is much more for me to learn.